As a foreign woman with a Chinese husband, I couldn't help but wonder why we're so rare
When I’m in China, I tend to turn a lot of heads, especially in the countryside — and that’s not just because I’m a foreigner. It’s because I’m often seen holding hands with my Chinese husband.
It’s true — the sight of a foreign woman and Chinese boyfriend or Chinese husband is much rarer than its counterpart, the foreign man and Chinese woman.
If you go to any major city in China, you will invariably run into the foreign man-Chinese woman pairings in any major tourist or shopping destination; not so with foreign women and Chinese men. It’s easy to gauge this reality on the website Candle for Love (CFL), devoted to helping US Americans bring their loved ones over from China. CFL is like a tidal wave of American men in love with Chinese women, with only a rare American woman/Chinese husband surfacing to break the monotony.
There are hardly enough books depicting foreign women with Chinese boyfriends or husbands. Off the top of my head, I can think of Rachel DeWoskin’s Foreign Babes in Beijing: Behind the Scenes of a New China
Several years ago, when my husband enrolled in a New Oriental class in Shanghai for GRE prep, the instructor warned all of the Chinese men: “If you’re going to study abroad, prepare for four lonely years.” The underlying message was, don’t expect to fall in love — but be pleasantly surprised if it happens.
When you have a Chinese husband or boyfriend, sometimes you feel as if you belong to a lonely club. I’m not the only one. One of my dearest e-mail friends, a woman from Germany, once found me on the net because she had a — then — Chinese boyfriend and yearned to find someone to share her experience with.
So I began to wonder — why are there so few Chinese guys and foreign girls becoming couples?
Of course, some of it has its roots in the usual stereotypes — stereotypes in the Western World.
According to Sheridan Prasso’s book, The Asian Mystique: Dragon Ladies, Geisha Girls, & Our Fantasies of the Exotic Orient
If there are some admirable aspects of the portrayals of Asian women in Hollywood and on TV, it’s hard to say the same of the portrayals of Asian men. Rarely have they been depicted with traditionally masculine traits. With a few exceptions, Asian men on screen have been small, sneaky and threatening — or spineless, emasculated wimps, or incompetents who may well be technically proficient in martial arts, but impotent when faced with white man’s superior strength or firepower. Lacking machismo, they almost never get the girl.
The article Sex & the Asian Man also touches on many of Prasso’s observations, including the passionless warrior:
Even today, Asian American men complain that action heroes such as Chow Yun Fat and Jackie Chan rarely get the girl. As Leong, the author and UCLA professor put it: “Asian men can kick butt, but they can’t have a kiss.”
It gets a little more personal in blogs, such as posts titled Us Bitter, Bitter Asian Men or Sucks to be an Asian male.
Still, there’s another perspective.
I’ve had Chinese guys refuse me because they felt, as a traditional man, they could never see themselves married to a foreign girl. However, the subtext is often that foreign women are a dangerous choice — too casual, the temptress, etc — or could not accept a Chinese way of life. Generally, the pressure to split up comes from the family since, after all, in China, marriage is a family affair.
There was one Chinese boyfriend who told me, flat out, that his parents would never accept me. I don’t doubt he loved me in the beginning — but once his family knew, I suspect they made it clear that there was no future in what we had. Even my own husband was first told by his parents that he could be friends with a foreign girl, but not date her. Fortunately, their ideas changed when they met me in person!
On the other hand, there are Chinese men — and their families — who would be happy to have a foreign woman in the family. But there are other complications. For example, my good friend in Hangzhou, Xiao Yu, once told me that some Chinese men cannot overcome their feeling of inferiority — that being an American girl, a citizen of one of the most powerful countries in the world, made my presence somewhat intimidating. According to Xiao Yu, some Chinese men could never believe that such a girl would become their one and only.
And then there are the more unmentionable reasons.
A driver who took me to the Beijing Airport this summer admitted he once had a Russian girlfriend when he was a college student. But he said he was never able to satisfy her (yes, in that way), so they parted. The experience was so traumatic that he never sought another foreign girlfriend again.
On the flip side, I suspect that some foreign women might be unwilling to give Chinese men a chance because of money. Average Chinese men tend not to earn big salaries in China, unless they are, for example, bosses, high-powered execs, or an in-demand talent. And if they are to leave China to go to her country, they will face even more obstacles to earning money — language, culture, prejudices.
Still, despite the odds, sterotypes and other barriers, it does happen that Chinese men and foreign women get together. It happened for me — and a growing number of other women, including bloggers such as the Local Dialect, Lost Laowai, and Wo Ai Ni. On occasion, it even creeps into the news, like this story.
For now, though, I’m just happy to have John, my Chinese husband, in my life. Not because he’s a Chinese man, or because our relationship is “unique” or different. But because I love him.
Are you a foreign woman with a Chinese boyfriend/Chinese husband? Or are you a Chinese man dating or married to a Chinese woman? What’s your take on this? What did I miss? I’d love to hear from you!
Posts Like This One:
- China Blogs by Western Women who Love Chinese Men
- Ask the Yangxifu: How Chinese men can meet foreign women in China
- Western Wives, Chinese Husbands — Guest Interview Piece at Middle Kingdom Life
- Ask the Yangxifu: How Western Women Can Meet Chinese Men in China
- Ask the Yangxifu: How can Western women and Chinese men get along – as a couple?
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Hi Rich,
Thanks so much for your comment, and for sharing this website! I’m sure it will be of interest to my readers, so I’m adding it to my links.
I don’t know if my story will help anyone but, I do need a bit of confirmation to move over this road block, and regain my courage.
I think it was a month or 2 ago now that I had a crush on this Vietnamese boy. (Even though this topic seems centered around Chinese men..I’ve never met any, except for this one INCREDIBLE waiter I had back in Hong Kong a couple of years ago. He was sweet, and shy, and very courteous to my dad, and I when we went to the resturant. We even came back a couple of times, because we enjoyed talking with him. BUT this is a story of anyother time ^^;)
Anyways, I had a crush on this Vietnamese boy, and I told my close friend (whom happens to be asian also) about him. After a week or 2 she realised she had the same math class as him, and wanted to see if he would be interested for me. I blatantly refused, so like the good best friend she is, she found a way to humiliate me by figuring a way to drag me to him (even though I was refusing any help whatsoever!), and make me confess. I made a compromise with her: that if I promised to confess to him by myself she’d stop trying to force me to. Well being semi-shy as I am..it took me a good part of 3 weeks to get the courage to tell him.
And so I did. My result…rejection. I didn’t know what the problem is..but I thought maybe it could be because I appear African American? (I’m a Somali American, and cupids’ arrow shoots right through me at the sight of ANY Asian male. ^^)
But after that I began to have doubts that any asian man would find me attractive. I know..I’m not supposed to let this hurt cloud my rational mind..that just because of this ONE time, doesn’t mean it’ll happen again. But it took a lot to get my courage to tell him, and then I got refused..I even had the right mind-set, that I’d be ok, and support him if his parents wanted him to dump me, or if we got stares, and finger points. Maybe I got my hopes too high?
But just a couple of weeks ago my best friend who has his math class said she thinks he likes her. She also said that he didn’t know she was asian about a month ago, but now…I can’t help but think that “does he like her because she’s asian?” I didn’t particutarly have feelings for him until she told me that he might like her that faithful day a couple of weeks ago (or at least I convinced myself I didn’t have feelings). But hearing that just hurt me again, and now I’ve got my eyes set on anyother asian man, but I just can’t recover that last hurt to pursue this new affection.
Anyone have any advice, or comments? They’re greatly appreciated!!
~Yaz
Hi
I’m also married to a Chinese man – have been since 1997. I’m writing a series of articles looking at the lives of the women in his family – my mother-in-law, sisters-in-law and nieces-in-law. If anyone is interested, please take a look. It’s in its early stage, but expect more posts soon.
http://foreignerinthefamily.blogspot.com/
Thanks!
Dear Yaz…
My heart goes out to you, and though I cannot be absolutely certain about what really happened to you from the viewpoint of someone on the scene, I feel compelled to point out two things I learned from my own experiences.
First, most of the Somali people I have encountered were quite attractive and charming. I can twig that you have a wonderful personality, and I’ll bet good money that you turn many more heads than you think when you walk by. It’s not empty flattery, because how your friend behaved may actually confirm the truth of my words.
Though your letter is brief, it is very concise, and everything you said points to a deeply competitive “friend”. Re-read your own letter, and as yourself a few questions, like, would a person who knows and loves me well willfully, and with abundant knowledge of my insecurity, *force* me into an encounter she knows will traumatize and humiliate me… *and* him? This arrangement was obviously intended to achieve the results it did, and with the expected terminal fail, why would a loving friend then “confide” to you that *your* former love interest is now attracted to *her*? If the role were reversed, how would you have felt and behaved? I am thinking, not the same as your un-friend did. According to your own frankly honest and sincere letter, your wise heart sees something your self-doubts do not want you to see… Your “friend” is actually an enemy, and the smart thing to do is the courageous thing… Shower your un-friend with indifference, and find a real friend who think your friendship and trust are more important than a boost to her own weak ego at your expense. You would be pleasantly surprised at how much the upgrade in friend quality can improve your own self-worth.
As for your appeal to Asian men, I know a number of Asian men who would only date “dark ladies”, and they married a black or copper-skinned beauty too. I can assure you this is not an isolated coincidence or a generational thing. As your un-friend well knows, most (Not all!) Asian men are extremely shy about their sexual appeal to ladies of non-Asian races or cultures. I can promise you with absolute certainty that, sans the static from a viciously competitive “go-between”, you’ll be quick to discover that your shy but warm personality is actually quite irresistible, especially when combined with your exotic looks and naturally optimistic mindset . I can clearly read a near-future for you happily snuggling in the shoulder of a handsome Asian man… I have to smile in irony as I firmly assert that an old worn-out adage really applies to you in this case… Just be yourself, and you will be loved for being exactly who and what you are…. Specifically, by Asian men.
From now on, confine yourself to a test that worked for me for years… Firmly commit to the pledge of telling your intended your feelings for him *before* you tell anyone else. If you cannot build up the courage to tell him first, then you are not at a place emotionally where it is safe to confide in someone else. Even a well-intentioned friend will be subjective, and may be tempted to meddle if you do not move as fast as she would. That said, a real friend doesn’t sink the ship and then pose herself as the rescuer and claim the reward. Cut that dead anchor loose, and you will not only move on, you will move upward, where both of you know you belong… A beautiful butterfly must spread her wings… Best of luck and love to you.
Faithfully, Phoenix Dawnsinger
Phoenix, what a generous reply! I could not have said it any better.
Yaz,
I completely agree with Phoenix, that this sounds like a case of sabotage from a friend who is not really your friend. As for Asian men not being interested in dark-skinned women…as Phoenix said, there are definitely Asian men out there who would want to date you. From my experience with Chinese men, the Chinese guys who usually end up dating foreign women of all types tend to be a little more unconventional, willing to buck the traditional ideas the generations of the past may have had about dating/marriage (and even what family says — which was the case for my husband). Indeed, just be yourself, as Phoenix said.
Good luck to you, and hope you can, as my husband often says, “courageously move forward.”
Dear Elliot,
Thanks for sharing your background, and your blog. In the published world, there really is a dearth of voices from foreign women in China who have become so close to the culture, as you have. I applaud your efforts, and added your blog to my “Foreign Women + Chinese Men” links, and will continue to follow you.
To Phoenix and Jocelyn,
Thank you both for your moving words, and wonderful advice!
Re-reading my story, and taking into account what Phoenix said, I’ve realized that maybe I do have a *friend* undeserving of me. I’ve probably unconsciously over-looked that possiblility, as I like to see the good in people, and not judge them for false crimes which they seemingly cannot (but they can) commit. Friendship and kindness can make one turn a blind eye to others’ sometimes. Although it’s a good thing to be kind, but just not to the point of naivety, which I am mostly certainly guilty of. ^^;
I will heed your advice, and cut my dead anchor loose. If not it being a block in my road to success, then for it not being a faithful, and honest anchor.
Once again thank you both for the words of wisdom, and I wish you the best, as I will certainly try mine to correct this situation.
~Always, Yaz
Yaz and Jocelyn…
*Blush*!!!!!!!!! I was just shooting from the hip. Thank you for your kind words! Lots of love and luck to both of you!
Faithfully, Phoenix
Thank you for your article, Jocelyn. I have been dating my Chinese American boyfriend for two years now, and we plan to be engaged within the year. I still haven’t met many members of his family, particularly his grand parents, but this article makes me feel better about meeting them. He’s warned me that I may not ever gain the approval of the oldest members of his family, but they’ll always be polite. His family immigrated from China about 30 years ago, so they are very traditional. At first, his mother didn’t like the idea of her eldest son dating a Caucasian girl, but she has really opened up to me and given me a chance. I do hope to earn the affection of his grand parents some day, but I suppose we all need to start somewhere.
Next semester, I am going to start learning Chinese through a Mandarin course offered in my university. I am hoping that learning his family’s language will help matters and will enable me to speak for myself when we travel to Hong Kong.
Thanks for your comment, Turtle, and for sharing! I’m glad my article helped you prepare for meeting your boyfriend’s family. That is fantastic you’re learning Chinese — this will definitely help build bridges with the family. As I found, once my husband’s, then boyfriend’s, parents (particularly his father) found I could speak good Mandarin, they opened up a lot more, and were willing to accept the idea of a foreign daughter-in-law.
Hope you’ll keep me posted on how things go. Good luck!
I suppose there are several older posts from before I started reading your blog. I stumbled upon this one today and I can’t stop looking at the picture. Your dress is absolutely beautiful and unique. Is it from here or from China? It’s gorgeous!
Thanks for the comment, Melissa.
Hope this is not too off-topic for the folks subscribed to the comments on this post…but the dress is from China. I had it tailor-made in Suzhou (they have a “wedding dress city” — endless possibilities, unbelievably affordable). If you, and others, are interested, I may just have to do a little review about this place.
Hi Jocelyn!
Actually, do tell… Smile! I’m definitely interested!
Later, Phoenix
I am a white redheaded woman married to a Chinese man (9 years next week!). We live outside of Chicago with our three beautiful half chinese daughters. I understand your perspective of “standing out” so much in China. With my very white skin and red hair, I really stood out. Plus, both times we have visited China we took our eldest daughter and that created even more stares. People couldn’t believe there was a Chinese man married to a white woman with a half chinese daughter. We had people ask if they could get their picture taken with us, my husband told them no, he didn’t want us to be a freak show. (I joked that if we made people pay for the pictures with us that we could pay for another trip to China.) But mostly people smiled or tried to touch our daughter, whom they thought was so pretty with such white skin. I love China and would move there in an instant, but getting used to all the “attention” does take a while. Even here in the Chicago Chinatown we are stared at a lot by the resident Chinese. We see a lot of Chinese woman/white man matches, but very few like us. It is nice to meet someone who understands my situation.
Dear Sarah,
It’s so great to hear from you — and welcome to what’s turning out to be not necessarily the “lonely club” I thought it was! You sounds like an outstanding couple, and how wonderful to have three lovely daughters.
(BTW, as an aside, Lao Sichuan in the Chinatown is still one of my favorite Chinese restaurants in the US.)
I was once married to a white woman. I agree with most of what you said. It is rarly. Have you seen a video on youtube ” yellow fever”, i think it is very true, even ABC get the same problem. Or you can look through a website called http://www.asiancaucasianturf.com.
Hi Hata,
Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts — and for sharing that website. It’s great to see that communities are starting form for people like us.
It’s so nice to finally find this blog. I’ve been in China almost 4 years, struggling with so many of these same problems. One I dated my first Chinese boyfriend it was like the whole world changed. And yeah, he left me because I “made too much”
I’m still having problems, even tho these days I can manage the language pretty well, I’ve adapted to many customs, and I’m not the type who wants to party and play, I want the marriage and the kids!
Why is it still so hard to find someone?
Dear Brandy…
Please do not be discouraged… Smile!
My instincts suggest that your dilemma has less to do with cultural norms and more along the line of gender issues and modern economic circumstances. Please let me explain…
Once upon a time a very big war happened. Men left behind a society and culture that, until that time, was geared entirely toward them being in charge of everything but child rearing and domestic chores. With hubby abroad, many women discovered that they did a much better job of fending for themselves than their husbands had for both of them, and, now you have the phenomenally high divorce rate that ensued after said war was over. Flash forward to the last ten years unto present and you can see that single income households are impossible to support, unless you really are rich. Most of us are not.
My point is, women are sort of in a “double-damned” situation. Smart men know that they need a woman who can pitch in a paycheck… BUT… Many men (And women!) want to cling to a double standard. Men are still taught that their “worth” is in their ability to be a good provider, and still others feel their job and/or paychecks are their identity or means to power and control, if only over their own lives. Many people have shamelessly admitted to me that they want a mate who is both a provider and a domestic while they are only a provider or only a domestic. It’s offensive and irrational thinking in my book, but there you are. The bottom line… If you are a woman bread-winner, and worse, you have the confidence to assert your competence, or, you want to enforce a double standard… Don’t expect the guys to climb over each other in their efforts to ask you out.
In counterpoint, if like me, you were reared in an always chaotic environment where the only thing you could depend on was that people and rules are arbitrary, it’s likely you overcompensated and became a “Jill-of-all-trades”. I was amazed to discover how often this happens, and it essential does because the only person one could trust to finish something correctly and in a timely fashion, was themselves.
The only thing that will literally save your soul and sanity is to NEVER allow yourself to become bitter, or to quit. This is a problem that can be solved. Not easily, but it can…
First, sit down and look at yourself as if you and your life were a business operation. Who would you put in charge of what? Being able to delegate responsibilities is the first and most powerful investment of trust, and let me tell you, trust is nine-tenths of love’s ingredient list. Be brutally honest with yourself, and not just with the criticism, but with realizing what your real strengths and priorities are. If you did your homework correctly, you just found the basic outline for what man would be most compatible with you and your lifestyle, because like the interlacing finger of your two hands, his purpose is to be strong where you are weak, and to be humble in the areas where you are strong.
You may discover that you need a “house husband”, or, you need to find that rarest of fellas who can actually one-up you. In either case, and in all cases in-between, let me paraphrase what I said in an earlier post… “We are together to make each others lives just a little bit better, happier, more productive, just a little more often than our lives were before we met.” That’s the most basic essential for ALL relationships.
In closing, my experience suggests that Chinese men are actually a little more sensible than most about women being bread winners, but no man is immune to the equally sensible fear that a (insecure) woman in power often is a “ball-buster”. Tough enough to get past that stereotype, but you are not the only one who needs consistency and trust in a mate. Once he is shown where he belongs in your life, let him stay in charge of those arenas, no matter how bad the disagreement gets, and don’t try to renegotiate or go behind his back. Both of you will always make a few mistakes, but I can promise you, if you are ALWAYS loving and consistent, love will win over any doubt or anger. That’s not an euphemism, it’s a proven fact in all healthy relationships.
You deserve to be loved Brandy, and you couldn’t pick a more devoted, dependable, and affectionate mate than a Chinese man… But like most of the ladies here, I’m a bit biased! (Laughing!) I wish you abundant luck and love. I know you will find it…
Sincerely, Phoenix Dawnsinger
I do not know about anyone else. Many children of Asian-white couples including Chinese men-White women couples tend to be super-smart and high achievers.
Dear Brandy, thanks for the comment, and welcome to our not-so-lonely club!
I’m sorry to hear your first didn’t work out. Mine didn’t either. And neither did my second. It wasn’t until my third Chinese boyfriend (John), that things really worked out. So, it may take some time, but you can find him. Don’t give up, because you sound like a wonderful girl, and you deserve to find true love.
It really does take an unconventional Chinese guy to get over issues like money (and, in the case of my husband, the fact that his wife is taller than him!). Some men never can get over it, and that is too bad. But the ones that don’t care, the ones that can look beyond all of that…they are gold.
I wish I could give you an answer on why it is hard, beyond what I’ve written in this post. I don’t know what you have experienced, but I can imagine how it has made you feel. I’ve been there.
You might find some inspiration from a recent article I wrote, with some suggestions for meeting Chinese men.
There are some great Chinese men out there who would love to have you as their own. Please hang in there, and don’t lose hope.
Dear Phoenix, as always, you provide such eloquent answers that I have nothing more to add. You astound me. Thanks for giving Brandy some advice.
Dear George, thanks for the comment.
I am not that tall 5 feet 10, but I like tall girls. I want my GF to be 5 feet 8
I got over it
If people look back to the 21st century, they will see it is very rich cultural period when the East and West are harmonized and synthesized. One of so far untapped cultural springs is evolved from the interactions between the Chinese man and Western woman. Opposites attract. As China regains its confidence and make a greater contribution to the world, you will see the Chinese man will not be shy to bring what is in him to the table. The first wave of the Western women interested in that will be pleasantly surprised by the new findings. I am a Chinese, educated in Chinese culture, living in America, dated almost all white women, and married to one. I was determined to bring out what is in my pocket to the table to exchange with what the white women will bring to the table. Life had been very rich indeed.
Dear timur,
Thanks so much for your thoughtful comment. When I hear from you and many others, it gives me hope that there will be more couples like us — and that, someday, we won’t have to talk about the “rarity” anymore.
(first off i’d like to let you know your captcha on the contact form is not working. i wanted to send this via email to you)
Hi Jocelyn
i noticed you had a link on your site somewhere to our site womenforasianmen.com.
i’ve only been made aware by this recently by a back links search on google, but i dont see it anymore, but i wanted to tell you shoot a thank you to you. i absolutely adore your blog (and you!). your perspective on interracial relationships (especially concerning asian male/white female) is..well awesome ^_^
i’d like to extend a warm invitation to our site.
Hi — thanks for letting me know about the problem with the Captcha form. I replaced my contact form, tested it, and you should have no problem using it to contact me now.
And I’m really glad you like my site. Thanks for the warm invitation.
I’ve been editing my links recently, so check — it should be there now (under Foreign Women + Chinese Men).
I have recently started talking to a Chinese male and noticed that my fellow American friends (or people who I thought were friends) are extremely opposed to the idea of an American female dating a Chinese male. Some of the things people have said are downright hateful and, if I may say, ignorant. I did not realize my generation was still so overwhelmingly opposed to interracial dating (I’m 25). Why are people so opposed to Western women dating Chinese men? Do our Chinese classmates/friends feel the same way about him dating me?
While, I’ve never dated a Chinese guy before, it has nothing to do with being Chinese. Culture and ethnicity are not factors that influence my decision to date someone. In fact, I’ve been enjoying learning about his culture and getting to know each other. I also enjoy that he’s more traditional and takes his time with the courting process. He is thoughtful, respectful, smart, intuitive, I can go on forever…. My grandfather even commented on how this is the “proper” way to date someone. He’s fine with me dating a Chinese male as long as his family accepts me.
Why are other people so openly opposed to Western females dating Chinese males? There seems to be an extra sense of hostility towards this mixture, as opposed to other interracial dating. Did those of you married/dating an American/Chinese experience this issue? If so, how did you overcome this obstacle?
Dear Concerned,
Thanks for the comment — and you bring some good questions to the table, here. I think most of us in relationships like ours will experience the unfortunate flip side (the ignorance, hate, stereotypes).
Why opposed? The short answer — we have culture to blame, because we live in a culture that has decided it is not a normal relationship (which may be a colonial hangover from centuries of having an “Asian mystique” that seems to favor Chinese women, not Chinese men). We don’t see people like us in mainstream movies or TV, as I wrote in this entry. It’s not just the men, either — often women buy into, and perpetrate these ideas (like this post).
For some Chinese, there is a flip stereotype of Western women that often bars relationships — that we’re easy seductresses (and not good for marriage), which I also write about above. In the case of Chinese parents, who imagine the stereotypes from movies/tv/ads in China, it certainly can be an opposition; for others, it’s a curiosity (as in, how could these two come together?).
I’ve been lucky not to have experienced the hostility — but I will say, I have seen other people hostile towards my Chinese husband, in subtle, microaggressive ways. I think many decide, because of his stature, gentle voice, etc., that he either doesn’t merit attention or respect. I’ve seen some in his university (students and faculty) behave or speak to him in ways I thought demonstrated a lack of confidence or understanding, when I know he doesn’t merit that.
But I’d be interested to hear from others, how they overcame the obstacles.
Having lived in the east during the past decade, I also know of many white expat American women in places such as Singapore who wont date white expat men who have dated local Asian or even Asian American women. To them these men are damaged goods. If your date is from mainland China, it is very difficult to decipher..the relationship between the US and China have not been at its best. However, if your date is from Taiwan, Hong Kong, Malaysia or Singapore and definitely if he is Chinese American, the answer is very clear…racism and bigotry!
Hi George,
That is an unfortunate case of ignorance and it does reflect a point of racism and bigotry if those attitudes extend to other people who just “look similar”. It is very degrading to what it means to be human. Actually, those expat women you mentioned are probably not worth the trouble of starting a relationship with in the first place if their mentality is like that.
“That is an unfortunate case of ignorance and it does reflect a point of racism and bigotry if those attitudes extend to other people who just “look similarâ€.”
Your point is well taken. eg. there are a lot of Irish people who wont date or marry other white people or white Americans of English origin, ie., English and there are a lot of Serbians who wont date other whites, eg. Croations, Macedonians or Slovenians. But, most of it is due to history. Race related prejudice is born of contempt and colonialism rather than historical hatreds. People looking down on a white woman marrying someone of Chinese origin is born of contempt and derision rather than historical hatreds between whites and Chinese. In fact, I know a white male married to a Chinese American woman who is dead against his sister dating a Chinese American male…this case sound like one of irrationality.
@Friend, thanks for commenting. I agree — the expat women George mentions aren’t worth the time.
@George, thanks for weighing in on this issue. You voiced something that has long been nagging me — that there is some leftover colonialism at work here in why people might be so against Chinese men and Western women becoming couples. I’m intrigued and might just have to look into this further.
This is because in America, the media is controlled by White MEN, who will only promote AF/WM relationship, but Not AM/WF. It is clear that it is RACIST, but Asian men are not in control and thus have to suffer if they want to live in America.
In America, people will not be concerned if AF date White guys but if WF start to date Asian guys, then you will see tons of stereotypes and racism toward them. Sad but true.
“It is clear that it is RACIST, but Asian men are not in control and thus have to suffer if they want to live in America.”
Asian men are not in control in America but they control America from outside the country..they hold the US debt, Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, Taiwanese, Hong Kongers and Singaporeans. But, the fact is they rarely use the power.
“In America, people will not be concerned if AF date White guys but if WF start to date Asian guys, then you will see tons of stereotypes and racism toward them. Sad but true.”
The only problem is that many abroad, particularly in Singapore do not believe that this is true!
http://www.expatsingapore.com/forum/index.php?topic=59638.msg1535564
Kindly read the last few posts! And the guy who pointed this out is branded a racist!
“You voiced something that has long been nagging me — that there is some leftover colonialism at work here in why people might be so against Chinese men and Western women becoming couples. I’m intrigued and might just have to look into this further.”
People need to get their current events right. Saw an interesting movie from India. The moneylender comes into the indebted guy’s home, grabs his daughter and basically says, all debt is forgiven because I am going to marry your daughter. Colonial times are long past. Today China controls the US economy through its treasury holdings. The Chinese are the moneylenders here…may be they should walk in and say that “many of “our men”, professional men in particular dont have wives due to the gender imbalance. You send us brides to marry Chinese men, and we ill forgive your debt.”
On a happier note, two Chinese men-white women couples married for nearly thirty years with smart successful kids…all of them daughters….
http://newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/race/2008/06/interracial-mar.html
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=82eef069-9da1-4953-943a-a51c6613d0aa
@Slipknot, thanks for having your say in the conversation! I would definitely agree that many Asian men do suffer in the US — I have experienced this through my husband.
@George, thanks for sharing your thoughts once again, and giving us the perspective from Singapore. You put forth some interesting ideas! I enjoyed the links — they are a heartening reminder that families like ours can and do work (nice too to see they have daughters!).
I, too, found the love of my life in a Chinese man. He and his family have been in the states for 15 years and I’m blessed to have him in my life. We’ve been married for 6 months now and I look forward to many more years of happiness. My only concern is with his family. He still has not introduced us and they don’t even know he’s married. When I question him about the secrecy, he just tells me that, as a white woman, I will not be accepted into the family and he’s trying to save me the heartache of how his family, particularly his mother, will mistreat me. I don’t know how long he can keep this marriage a secret and I fear that the longer he waits to tell them, the harder the news will be for them to understand. Pray that things will work out well for us.
Dear Sarah,
Thanks so much for sharing with us. How wonderful that you found true love with a Chinese man! But what a shame that you cannot share the happiness with his family. I also hope that, with time, they will learn to love and accept you as a member of their family.
i was surprised about this website.thought i was the only one with this problem.and a little bit more.well iam i think. I am western women 56 and fell head over heels in love with my brothers driver 43 .there was electricity between us .we did not talk to each other.after 3 months i came back and those feelings were still there.and now we talked and he acknowledged the same experience.said he loved me but no good could come of it.he let himself fired as the driver and told me he did not really know why he did.the only thing he did know was that it was totally impossible culture money,education,age!!!!!!!wise.since august silence .what should i do.go back to shanghai in may.
Dear yetti, thanks for sharing your experience.
That is heartbreaking, and I can relate, having fallen in love with Chinese men who later gave up on us. Some Chinese take a very practical approach to love and marriage, preferring to find someone normal they can have a peaceful life with, instead of marrying someone they are passionately in love with (but may create difficulties for them b/c of family or otherwise).
I don’t know if this is the case with this man. Maybe you can try talking to this man again — maybe you can go to Shanghai, and he might still love you and be open. But you might want to contact him before you do anything rash. If he continues to rebuff you or discourage you, it may not bode well for your relationship.
There may be some culture or man/woman differences. To an American woman, love is the most important. After you take layers off in the Chinese culture, heart is very important. Traditionally, a good heart is what he is aspired to, which makes him more stable, not necessarily romantic at times, unless he is driven by his hormones. So it takes longer time to reach the heart of a Chinese man, who is in general guided by his rationality, practicality, and the distrust of intuition. This has helped him to be dependable and surviving in hard times. So the middle way approach may be the answer. Make the Chinese more intuitive and make the American woman more stable.
Thanks for the comment, timur. What you wrote — “it takes longer time to reach the heart of a Chinese man” — is so true from my experience. Chinese men can be more rational, practical than what we’re used to, so patience (on the part of Western women) really is important in forming relationships.
I have been married to my Chinese husband in Bay Area for more than 20 years. I am a San Francisco born Irish-German, and he came to country first as a foreign student. I am 5’8″ and he is 5’6″, we have our ups and downs, but I love him more than ever. To marry to a Chinese guy, actually is like marrying to his whole family (true in most marriages). My husband is smart and hard working, and a very good lover.. it is simply not true that the media portray Asian men as “small”, as my white ex-husband 6’3″ who is a control freak is not even half as good as what my Chinese husband can offer. If you are going for Chinese men, you got to be mindful that most Chinese men are very practical, thrifty and hard working people. Chinese men as a whole prefer practical, thrifty and intelligent women. That is why most Chinese M /White F dating happens mostly in schools or higher learning institutes, very few Chinese men just go out and pick up any white women for casual relationship. Chinese men in general are more sensitive, introvert and intricate in their thinking and planning, they don’t just “go for it” like most Western men, as Chinese men take failures very seriously. Moreover, they are more reliable, respectful and loyal as a husband if they love you, they do protect their family (similar to Italians)… Also, one thing very seldom mentioned (which is the most important thing) in Chinese M/ White F relationship is – the way they look at money. The main reason most Chinese men do not go for White women, is that most Chinese men take dating very seriously, they are always thinking long term.. in their mind they think most Western women are not good with money but they are good lovers, (their thinking is very similar to the Jewish Men), also the Western women can turn on a dime in love and want out, and the financial ruins will follow.. Being in business with my husband, I get to know that there are so many wealthy Chinese men (men controls the family wealth in Asian culture) here and from Hong Kong, Taiwan, China and whole SE Asia, and there are probably more Chinese multi-millionaires than the millionaire white male in this planet. But very few well-to-do Chinese men are willing to marry a white women for the reason I mentioned above, and I hope this is gradually changing. That is also why you see so many Asia F/ White M marriage, because it is easier for Asian F to marry White M for safety or monetary reasons (most immigrant women) or love (in higher learning institutes or workplace).. but Asian men do think entirely different when it comes to dating or marriage…
Dear Sheryl,
Thank you so much for the comment, and for your insight into why couples like us are so rare. I never thought about the money issue — that’s an interesting explanation. I absolutely agree that practicality about marriage is a big issue for many Chinese men, and long-term thinking would certainly question the idea of pairing w/ a Western woman, given the stereotypes you mention.
Wow Sheryl… you have it right. My husband is also very practical and frugal. When we do have disagreements, they are often about money because I am a spender and he is a saver. However despite the fact I spend, I do so reasonably. I remember him telling me when we were dating that he liked the fact I didn’t have to wear designer clothing and shoes. I didn’t think much about that at the time, but since he was planning for a long-term relationship, evidently earlier than I, things like that were very important. Despite him being cheap, I wouldn’t trade him for all the gold in the world. His love and genuine caring for me make material things seem so unimportant in the long run.
Reading these comments, I almost forgot if you guys are talking about chinese men or a breed of show dog ( The Pit Bull terrier…”ahem”..chinese man has an ideal temperament, is friendly towards family, friends, and strangers alike. Known for its sound character, strong nerve, and great intelligence….)
I say this in jest of course. I agree with all the complaints/compliments posted here more or less. As a weird semi 2nd generation chinese born canadian/german/america, I have actually thought about why it is that there are so few chinese guys with other race girls and come to the conclusion that I came up with is it really comes down to chinese men themselves and how resilient they are. I think most people don’t realize the trauma that immigrating to a new land with strange peoples causes. Any social value/social hierarchy, they’ve built up in China is instantly gone. They are automatically demoted to the bottom of the ladder, and left for 2-3 years without any means to climbing at all ie language.
It is sort of a pet theory of mine that initial attraction/teenage type relationships are partly based on social value. So this plus all the media conditioning, racism, fear of family taboo is probably why there is a big barrier to Chinese men having the confidence to ask out a girl. Even when a girl is sending very very obvious “I like you signals”, they might be afraid to interpret those signals (it still hurts every-time I remember one)
It probably led to much missed happiness and not a small contributor to some Chinese men being angry at Chinese girls for being successfully intermingled with LaoWai.
After that mountain of possibly insensible rambling, I like to suggest things girls could have done when they approached me when I was younger. (though in hindsight totally not their responsibility to woo me)
1) go slow, if you are interested, form a acquaintanceship first. Things like work, class or some regular activity is best, where everyone shows up anyways and there’s no pressure.
2) Once you feel he’s pretty comfortable, ask the question explicitly. no confusion.
3) be willing to be the suitor at this first stage but you should expect him to step up eventually for a equal relationship to happen.
For Yasmin, take it from me, there are plenty of chinese guys who find African women attractive (my first kiss was with a black girl named Camilla in middle school in Raleigh)
@Sarah, thanks for sharing your experience! It’s always great to hear from other women with Chinese husbands.
@Justin Liu, thanks for the comment, and for offering your own advice on what Western Women can do to make a relationship with a Chinese man. Glad to hear that there are plenty of Chinese men who would consider dating an African woman!
When you mentioned literature, you left out one book with Asian male white female couple: Han Suyin’s ‘Till Morning Comes. Lovely picture by the way
and your husband looks cute.
Sveta, thanks so much for the sweet comment, and for suggesting another good read with an asian man and white woman! I will definitely have to pick it up.