Guest Post: What I've Learned from 15 Blind Dates in China | Speaking of China

73 Responses

  1. Manny
    Manny November 21, 2014 at 8:02 am | | Reply

    Hey Ted.

    Thanks for the great advice on Chinese girls. I did not know that they are so unlike the image that I am accustomed to in the U.S. I thought that Asian girls such as those China dolls are sweet and submissive.

  2. R Zhao
    R Zhao November 21, 2014 at 8:27 am | | Reply

    None of this is news to me, but I’m still not sure what to think of it. I understand the need to be somewhat practical when picking a life partner, but in ways it seems more like a business transaction with little feeling involved.

    I can’t wait to read through the sh!t storm of comments that this post will most likely produce.

  3. Constance - Foreign Sanctuary
    Constance - Foreign Sanctuary November 21, 2014 at 8:44 am | | Reply

    It sounds like some of these girls are just looking for an easy life. Maybe he can get his friends to introduce some girls to him – they know him and they would know if the two are compatible or not.

  4. Blue Rain Drops
    Blue Rain Drops November 21, 2014 at 9:53 am | | Reply

    What I found in this article is exactly what’s really going on in China nowadays. The sweet and submissive image of Chinese women which existed 50 years ago has disappeared for long. Instead, lazy, vainglorious and irresponsible are the precise descriptions of them.

    What’s not mentioned in the article is that I found a large portion of the younger generation of Chinese women never find faults in themselves. They insist dual criteria toward themselves and toward men. If a man has some better choice and dump his girlfriend, she would curse the man to death in groups with her friends; however, if a woman does the same thing, they would say that’s normal and understandable, and find ten thousand excuses to support her behavior.

    I’ve been living in the western world for long, and seldom see this happen on western women. I can’t understand the “Yellow Fever” taking place among American men, what’s the point of marrying a Chinese woman?

  5. Ri
    Ri November 21, 2014 at 10:44 am | | Reply

    Wow! Many of the women you’ve been meeting seem very demanding, very upfront and erm, kind of rude. ^^;
    I think Constance’s advice is soundーmaybe ask a friend to introduce you to someone? The matchmaker can explain in advance the good points about each person so that way both of you have an idea what the other person is like *and what you both want in life*ーor at least closely align your interests.
    Anyway, I wish you good luck with your dating adventures, and hope you find that special someone soon. ^^)b

  6. Allison
    Allison November 21, 2014 at 12:16 pm | | Reply

    My Taiwanese boyfriend has shared a similar story with me. He said his ex (who is also Taiwanese) wouldn’t clean or cook, so he would come home late in the evening after a long day at work, to do all of the cooking and cleaning. When I visit him (and he often works until 7 pm) I feel that I should do the chores and cook since I’m the one relaxing at his apartment. Maybe that’s just me feeling guilty for not working as much? I’m glad that my boyfriend appreciates what I do for him and vice versa. We get along very well 🙂

  7. Marta
    Marta November 21, 2014 at 2:33 pm | | Reply

    Wow, these blind dates go right to the point, haha. I can’t imagine meeting a guy for the first time and asking him about his salary and his career plans… that sounds like a job interview to fill the position of “husband”, hahaha. But that is the difference between most Western and Chinese girls, Western girls don’t go to a first date already thinking about marriage and it seems many Chinese girls do.

  8. Ted
    Ted November 21, 2014 at 4:18 pm | | Reply

    Thanks for comments from you guys, and I hope I can get more feedback from blog readers. Actually my parents and friends used to introduce girls to me before, but you know the situation is always the same.

    Chinese girls in my generation just ask too much, too much from men!!! To some extent , I think part of the problem in China is the one child policy and many of these girls grew up with a maid in their house and never learned to cook or clean or their parents may take care everything for them. Most Chinese girls lack the ability of living independently and no sense of security. The most importantly, girls do not have financial independence b/c arbitrariness of the spending is’moonlight clan’cause

    1. Marian
      Marian November 22, 2014 at 1:04 pm | | Reply

      Re: arbitrariness in spending

      In his most recent entry (May) Ben Ross explains some stuff with gender divide and cultural expectations:

      http://benross.net/wordpress/another-explanation-for-gender-line-in-hairstyling/2014/05/26/

      “The thing about women in China is that they don’t have the same responsibilities as men. They don’t need to provide for a family, save for an apartment, things like that. They can deal with the inconsistency of the income. Therefore, the unpredictable nature of the nail industry is more suitable for women.”

      “Men in China are under more financial pressure than women,” she told me. They are expected to purchase an apartment before getting married, and to have money saved. Women are aware that much of this responsibility rests on the men they will eventually marry, and so they are more free to spend their earnings on entertainment, such as dining out in expensive restaurants.”

      Even though I make more than most non-business owners / senior managers / senior salespeople (a whole hell of lot more if you adjust for hours actually worked versus hours spent on vacation), I’ve recently had more than one Chinese date tell me that the girl’s salary isn’t important because she only needs to spend it on fun things whereas the man’s salary is for taking care of the family (parents, wife, child, wife’s parents).

  9. Sorrel
    Sorrel November 21, 2014 at 9:30 pm | | Reply

    I have been working in a university in China for the last few years and unfortunately witnessed many girls similar to those you have described. Greedy, demanding, shallow and totally helpless about looking after themselves. I often wonder if it is by design that girls have been brought up like this in China so as their parents only accept a boy-friend/husband for them who will not only be financially able to support not only the girl but her parents as well.
    Most of the students I teach, which include post-graduates, lack basic life skills, are very impatient and have very unrealistic life expectations.
    Any relationship should be on equal terms, splitting chores and expenses where possible, and I constantly hear “I will marry a rich handsome husband so I don’t have to work.

    Ted, dating is not a race trying to get married asap.
    Girls (or guys) will never be satisfied in life if they don’t take the time to get to know a potential life partner well.
    There is no expiration date on meeting the right or most compatible person, and anyone who thinks there is, will head for disaster.
    A very good friend of mine met and married her Chinese husband when she was in her late 30’s. They have a beautiful son and are happy together.
    good luck!

  10. Holly Hollins
    Holly Hollins November 21, 2014 at 10:26 pm | | Reply

    I’m sorry after 15 blind dates you experienced all of these bad types. Hopefully you’ll find a foreign girl in Nanjing!. 🙂

  11. KenM
    KenM November 22, 2014 at 2:03 am | | Reply

    Just look over the border in Hong Kong, a marriage grave yard. The equation is so one sided nobody gets married and I actively avoid marriage after all the job interviews… I mean dates I’ve had.

  12. Fred
    Fred November 22, 2014 at 3:10 am | | Reply

    @ Ted,

    I am sorry to read that you are facing such difficulties from the Chinese girls. Since you said that you want to try dating a foreign girl, perhaps you can try girls of Russia or Ukraine. Here are some links showing bride tours. You will have to travel there along with a group of other men and then meet various girls at meeting functions. I do not know about the efficacy of these tours:

    http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2014/08/22/ukraine-matchmaking-wedding-industry-booming-foreigners.cnnmoney/

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4sA1pJNads

    Good luck.

    Fred

  13. Bruce
    Bruce November 22, 2014 at 8:14 am | | Reply

    Ted,

    I commented but was not posted. Don’t know why.

  14. R Zhao
    R Zhao November 22, 2014 at 8:46 am | | Reply

    The interesting thing is, these blind dates are often with people who are friend’s of friends or family members! I don’t know if this is true in Ted’s case, but for most of my Chinese friends where I live, it is. Yet these questions are still asked and it’s not considered improper.

    It can go both ways. I mean, it’s not ONLY men who have it bad. I have a good female friend who is from the countryside. She lives in the city now and has a stable (but currently low paying) job. Last year she was set up with a guy, a friend of a friend of a friend, and she thought it was going great. He was the one! They were going to get married! Soon there would be babies! And then. . .

    She met his mom. It was over. The mother was not having her son marry some girl who was from the countryside who made 1400 rmb/month.

  15. Canadian-Born Chinese Guy
    Canadian-Born Chinese Guy November 22, 2014 at 10:29 am | | Reply

    R Zhao, the example you describe is a problem between a mother and her son’s girlfriend. This article is more about ‘gender war’ dating issues between adult men and women, and expectations that women have of men.

    It would be interesting to hear from women what the perceived expectations are for them from the men that they date.

    1. R Zhao
      R Zhao November 22, 2014 at 7:17 pm | | Reply

      I think this post can be looked at in more than one way. There’s a lot of issues that come into play–not just simply gender wars.

      At the heart of the matter, I don’t think it’s love that matters to a lot of people in modern China. Marriage is a transaction. Of course, Chinese women tend to be more selective, but I think some men (and their families) expect a potential wife to have a certain background. There are expectations all around.

  16. Holy
    Holy November 22, 2014 at 2:40 pm | | Reply

    That’s true! I ever met many Chinese young girl exactly like that! They ask my salary and family background directly without any shame, which made me quite annoyed.

    Ted, I think you can look for a foreign girlfriend, you can ask your American friends introduce you a better girl~Hope you find someone suitable and have a happy marriage in the future~

  17. MM
    MM November 22, 2014 at 8:06 pm | | Reply

    @Canadian -Born Chinese Guy….. What l have heard ( and l am not sure if this is true or not ) is that the woman should be “beautiful” and to be able to bare a child.

    In regards to a “man must have a house”, this is the expectation however it’s still negotiated if and when the woman’s name is placed on the house deed.

  18. 国女
    国女 November 23, 2014 at 5:27 pm | | Reply

    要找洋媳妇不用贬低国女吧,我看你Facebook上面也没几个洋女,你确定找的洋媳妇吗,过几年回头找国女就难堪了,还用真名付照片

  19. KTCS
    KTCS November 23, 2014 at 6:05 pm | | Reply

    @ 国女 我是一个中国男人,现在在国外读书,我之前在国内也通过网络相过亲,我也有和TED 同样的经历。大多数中国男人都会觉得中国女人要的很多,而且很多时候,他们都会把责任推到男方这一边。而且我想西方女人也不一定是白人吧。在国外出生的人亚裔也是外国人,也是鬼妹,看来你一点常识都没有。

  20. Holy
    Holy November 23, 2014 at 6:07 pm | | Reply

    @ 国女 我是一个中国男人,现在在国外读书,我之前在国内也通过网络相过亲,我也有和TED 同样的经历。大多数中国男人都会觉得中国女人要的很多,而且很多时候,他们都会把责任推到男方这一边。而且我想西方女人也不一定是白人吧。在国外出生的人亚裔也是外国人,也是鬼妹,看来你一点常识都没有。

  21. Ted
    Ted November 23, 2014 at 6:19 pm | | Reply

    @ 国女 everything in my story was based on my real experience, it’s all real and nothing personal.If you think you do good with your lover, fine. Good luck to you.I jsut wonder why you blamed that on me? I don’t undrstand why did you do that?

  22. Ted
    Ted November 23, 2014 at 6:33 pm | | Reply

    @ Fred, Thanks for your comment. Time will tell the truth. I don’t wanna bear enormous pressure on dating and marriage thing. life is tough , we are more tougher. Just be myself ,be happy and be positive. Enjoy everyday in my life ! It takes much time but I am very confident for that.

  23. Ted
    Ted November 23, 2014 at 7:53 pm | | Reply

    @国女 from your comment you say’ there has no many foreign girls on my FB friend list’. I wonder how could you do that if you’re not a FB friend of mine? B/c I already set the privacy. Maybe you are one of my FB friends?? Maybe you are.

    Again,pls don’t get the wrong idea about my artical. My story based on my real blind dates experience in China, no sh!t,all real, nothing personal and I do not mean to anybody. I must admit still some good Chinese girls here however I haven’t had a chance to met them. In my story, I just demonstrate a common phenomenon in our society, Ok? The prob addressed in my artical has become the hottest issue in China currently. Yeah, every coin has two sides so different kinds of people hold the different opinions on dating and marriage. I buy it. Finally thanks for worrying about me, and thanks for your precious time to leave such a comment on this blog.

  24. Bruce
    Bruce November 23, 2014 at 11:26 pm | | Reply

    If this is like a business transaction in china, Let’s do it . That’s a lot of pressure for Chinese men to handle in China.

  25. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 12:14 am | | Reply

    @ Bruce Hi Bruce, yeah, Chinese guys are taking a lot of pressure indeed. For me, just be positive and trying to be stronger. As what I said before, time will tell us the truth.

  26. 国女
    国女 November 24, 2014 at 12:44 am | | Reply

    国内女人这麽多,我就不信个个要房要车,你只找上海南京女,自然人家要求高,一竿子打翻其他它省的乖乖女.上海女也跟你说白了,没钱没房没关係.只要你有外国籍可移民.可惜你也没有外国籍,你挑人家,人家也挑你,买卖不成仁义在,不需用外文写给洋人看

    你们几个懂外文,出过国的男人,照片看来也挺帅,我就不信国内你找不到漂漂亮亮的好女人,说白了就是自己要求条件高了些,你看上的国女,很不幸却看不上你的经济条件,找洋媳妇是好事,那个男人不想?但是难度绝对比找上海女难,你看有多少比例的国男能娶洋媳妇,再看看成功的,缘份占大部分,再穷的东欧毛妹也不会只看钱或国籍(别忘了你还没有),更别说北美或西欧的

    我想你发文的目的是要找洋媳妇,所以这位加拿大的洋媳妇在这帮你,问题是,这样盖括性的说国女,别说国女看不下去,洋女也不会因此喜欢你,我写中文洋女大部分也看不懂,没猜你的台吧

    1. Marian
      Marian November 24, 2014 at 12:52 am | | Reply

      Not that I’m going to make half of an attempt to respond in Chinese but 国女 you couldn’t be more wrong.

  27. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 1:54 am | | Reply

    @国女 我不想和你说太多。因为你的逻辑不够严谨 actually I don’t want to talk to you much b/c we don’t share the similar value. and I won’t say anything to you anymore. It’s all over. I think you don’t have such rigorous logic with your comment.

    1. 在上海和南京见的女孩一定是上海和南京人吗?事实上15个人中只有2个是上海人,2个南京的人,其他的11个都是其他地方的,有湖北,有黑龙江,有辽宁,有浙江等。而且大多数女孩子的学历和家庭条件都比我要差。

    I met 15 girls in Nanjing and Shanghai doesn’t mean those girls come from those two cities originally. Some girls from other provinces, like Hubei, Hei Longjiang, Zhe jiang or even small cities in JiangSu etc. Most girls I have met are worse than me, I mean educational and family background, of course including income status.

    2.在你的评论中反复提到‘钱’,你怎么知道我的收入不高?我也想问你在中国有多少29岁的男人可以自己独立买房?You repeat many times the word of ‘money’ in your comment.how do you know I don’t earn a good salary? I think in China,even white-collar workers do not have perfect pay based on American compensation level. I also want to ask you how many Chinese men like my age (29yrs) can afford a brand new apartment with their own efforts and not with parents’ support.

    3、你用中文,大多数在中国的老外能看得懂,而且就是看不懂也可以用翻译软件去翻译。
    Most western girls in China have a good command of Mandarin abilities and definitely read Chinese. They can also read Chinese through the help of translation software if they have any reading troubles.

    1. Marian
      Marian November 24, 2014 at 2:45 am | | Reply

      I don’t know if *most* of us can read Chinese but it’s safe to say that those of us who are reading a forum like this can probably read Chinese.

  28. SBC
    SBC November 24, 2014 at 8:18 am | | Reply

    I am not a fan of painting in big brushtrokes or generalizing across a population. There are good and bad in all races and nationalities. With chinese, there being so many of them, automatically means you would encounter many “bad apples” so to speak. However, I am not a typical for my culture so I know that there are several chinese women who will NOT fall in that category (I actually know many). So Ted, I would recommend what R Zhao did. Instead of relying on finding a soulmate who is non chinese (nothing wrong with that btw, I would completely stop wanting a chinese woman if I went through your experiences too), ask your friends to introduce you to some people, also meeting like minded women through common interests is another option.

    Now on the issue of social norms that underlie these behavior, I would have to sadly agree. I am not sure if this is also a function of education or something else, but I see many girls from Taiwan/mainland china/korea who are obsessive about their appearance and pay attention to little else. However this can simply be an individual trait present in many women.

    However one thing that i have noticed even more strongly is that many of these women find the idea of equal partnerships new and absurd. Men as providers seems to be the cultural norm and if you seek out men who can provide for you then they can likely afford a maid and leave much time for women to do nothing else with their life.

    Thankfully, norms change and there are ALWAYS people who question them and think before they act.

  29. SBC
    SBC November 24, 2014 at 8:25 am | | Reply

    I also want to point out some things. Stereyotyping is a dangerous territory.

    1. Chinese girls are spoilt, shallow and rude while western girls are perfect, bear equal burden in relationships etc..: is what a lot of the conversations are implying. I am sorry but NO. There are many western equivalents of these chinese women.

    2. Consider that blind date market would have people who seek certain things. they take these as business conversations because they ARE so. Its like expecting to find a healthy meaningful relationship with someone you hooked up with at a pub. There is a lot of self selection and expectations which have NOTHING to do with race or nationality.

    3. Just becayse one is bad doesnt mean the other is good: I cannot see the connection between western and chinese women here. They are women from different value systems. But I would argue that both would have drawbacks. Ultimately, generalizing doesnt help anything. Many times finding love is about finding that one person who is as odd as you are. They can be anyone and anywhere.

    I think these experiences are real and interesting but we need to step away from sounding like this is a unique feature of a weird species called chinese women or passing judgement on which value system is better (because finding love isnt about that).

  30. Bruce
    Bruce November 24, 2014 at 10:32 am | | Reply

    Ted,

    That’s why I can never marry a woman who only thinks about how I will buy a home or an expensive car for her. Sorry, I’m not interested!! You need a woman who believes in hard work and building wealth together. I know you will find a Chinese woman who will compromise with you. Maybe you need to meet more highly educated women in China with higher salaries to match with your beliefs. Ted, do you think that if you can provide an apartment for her and a maid and your marriage will be perfect ? The answer is NO! There is always something wrong in a marriage ( from experience). If you think a western woman is a good match for you. Go for it! Chinese women are not like decades before. My mom’s era was a good example of loyalty and responsibilities!!! She took care of the in laws and everybody !! Women like this are extinct like dinosaurs. Even til now that rich Chinese parents have to buy homes and businesses for their kids. This is ridiculous! They just don’t want to work hard at all!

  31. Caroline
    Caroline November 24, 2014 at 12:51 pm | | Reply

    1. The 15 may-be demanding, greedy girls do not represent all Chinese girls. But birds of a feather flock together, have you ever thought about your own reasons why the girls you met are all this kind of girls?

    2. I am a Chinese girl. I had many blind dates too. I have never asked their salary, future job career and never required money and apartment from a guy. Joss can be my witness. But I will never be interested in a mean guy who takes me to a fast-food restaurant for the first meeting. You are still a Chinese regardless your 6 years’ aboad life, you shall respect others if you want that from others. And I do think meeting on a fast-food restaurant for the first meeting is an insult.

    By the way, sorry for my straightforwardness, you are a very snobby guy, you had the most expensive dinner with the girl who returned from Japan. Why, can this explain something of your traits? Others girls are not even worth a normal dinner, instead of fast-food, because they did not return from Japan?

    3. Maybe western girls are less interested in apartment or something. But remember everything has an exception. So good luck!

    Finally would you pls do some introspection as to why you can only attack this kind of demanding and gready girl? Thanks!

  32. Caroline
    Caroline November 24, 2014 at 1:01 pm | | Reply

    Totally agree with SBC. Your opinions are really objective.

    1. 最恨伪女权
      最恨伪女权 November 24, 2014 at 10:53 pm | | Reply

      @Caroline
      我记得网上有一篇帖子,叫做“中国式女权是伪女权,本质要求不劳而获”,这篇帖子之所以火爆,因为它道出了中国当代的现实。当然,也会引发大量像你这样的伪女权主义者跳脚。

      在你要求别人自省之前,拜托,请你能不能先自省一下?什么叫做请女生到快餐店吃饭是一种insult? 男生选择哪个餐馆就餐,是他的问题,而女生如果主动提出来什么什么就是一种insult,那就是女生自己的问题了。这本身就是对男生的一种insult。想让人家请你去高档餐厅吃饭?先撒泡尿照照看你自己配不配。

      我从来不否认中国任何时候都有好女人的存在,但是据我的观察,实在是太少了。大部分中国女人就如同你这样的伪女权分子,对自己和对男生完全按照两种不同的标准来评价同一件事情。宽以待己,严以律人啊。臭毛病都是惯出来的,很多女人已经被宠到无法无天的地步了。

      支持Mr.Tao找个外国女友。说得对,让伪女权们都看看,中国男人不是别无选择。

  33. Bruce
    Bruce November 24, 2014 at 1:52 pm | | Reply

    I really have no respect for women or Chinese women who only ask men for materialistic items like homes, cars, high salaries !!!!!! Beside, I love women who are willing to get back to the job market after marriage. I just love women who go to work instead of staying home and cause problems.

  34. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 2:51 pm | | Reply

    @Caroline

    since you’re a Chinese girl probably your opinions could be very objective and You’re trying to protect the interest of majority of Chinese girls.

    1. did you read my previous comment. I said I must admit that there has some good Chinese girls there but I haven’t had a chance to meet , pls don’t get the wrong idea of my aritical, nothing personal I just talked about my blind dates experience in real…OK? otherwise I think you don’t have a good understanding on English. Pls do not misinterpret my artical.

    2. why a man cannot take a girl to a fast-food restaurant for a date? why not? if so I think you’re kinda materialistic. In western countries, people usually have a date in pizza hut or similar places like that. You denied yourself not a material girl but your words are obviously prove you are no much difference b/w other 15 girls I have met. Meeting in a fast-food restaurant for the first meeting is an insult??? Very new to me. In China , some white men take the Chines girls to noodle shops for first dates why no Chinese girls complain them? Not an insult based on your understanding.

    I am not a very snobby guy as you think, that girl asked me to take her eat in that fancy Japanese restaurant and she promised me she will pay half tab but she didn’t after eating dinner,OK? Don’t just express your idea without knowing too much actual information.

    Not only me but lots of Chinese men( including their parents )have dissatisfied with such situation in China. Have you ever think about men’s parents???? they work hard for the almost whole life and they are still trying to help their son to buy a new aparement for marriage ??? how horrible the truth is !! In my opinion, love is love don’t get involved in money thing too much.

  35. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 3:15 pm | | Reply

    in last comment very objective—-> very subjective…

  36. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 4:07 pm | | Reply

    Let me explain why I took that girl to the fast restaurant for the first meeting. This is the last comment I drop on this forum with my article.

    On Sep 28, 2014. It was raining cats and dogs outside, the most importantly there has no decent restaurants near my office( I worked on Sunday and she was nearby for shopping) so I recommended Mcdonald’s for our dinner and that girl was agreed. After going back home, she was kept complaining me about why I took her to the fast restaurant and something like personal attack( like I am a poor man, with no enough respect with girls etc). The girl I met is 23 and just graduated from college makes about 3000 RMB( 490 USD)a month, I don’t really care about how much she makes and her family background, but I never expected she thinks eating in fast restaurant is an insult. Geez!!!

    I always pay for the first meeting, I usually pay about 150-200 RMB for each time. I am definitely not a stingy man indeed.

  37. Caroline
    Caroline November 24, 2014 at 4:48 pm | | Reply

    @ Ted,

    Check your so many grammatical mitakes first before you say ” otherwise I think you don’t have a good understanding on English.”

    BTW, we ususally say “otherwise I do not think you have a good understanding in English.”

    There are so many kind, independent and so not greedy girls in China and I am so sorry that you do not have any chance to meet them. The level of the girls you can meet depends on your own level. I am sorry, you do not deserve any decent Chinese girls.

  38. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 5:25 pm | | Reply

    @Caroline
    I couldn’t help myself to write you back. English is not my mother tongue and I am trying to perfect it. I believe every reader in the forum understands me very well. Your written English has a bunch of typos , did you perceive that? Mistake ,not mitake… ok?

    don’t curse me, you jinx. Time will tell if I deserve any good girls. You’re not a saint so save your words!!!!

    1. 国男
      国男 November 24, 2014 at 8:48 pm | | Reply

      Tao 哥我觉得你的文章写得很实在,我也没看出有任何贬低“国女”之处,无任何不妥。虽然肯定不是所有中国姑娘都要房要车,但15个都如此绝对有可能。无论如何祝你最后找到自己中意的那个人儿

      P.S. 别动那么大气;)

  39. Wang Q
    Wang Q November 24, 2014 at 6:34 pm | | Reply

    Caroline,
    作为一个中国男人,看了你的评论,我觉得真的很无语。我和我现在的老婆也是我的大学同学第一次约会就是在校外大排档,她一点也没有被侮辱的感觉。那我想问,中国的农村地区,男人和女人约会就一定要去很高档的地方吃饭吗,就不能去快餐店吃饭吗?他们有的人连衣服都买不起,是不是这些人都不用谈恋爱结婚了呢?我觉得你们这些人太高看自己了。你们总是期待男方能给你们提供什么,给你们花钱去高档餐厅吃饭就是一定喜欢你们吗?去吃快餐店就是不喜欢你吗?姑娘, 你的想法太主观了。

    我身边的很多男性同事和朋友也都和我抱怨过,都说找对象很难。为什么很难?因为房价太高,他们买不起房子,每月也不能给女朋友买很多衣服鞋子化妆品之类的。现在的中国年轻女孩很多都很喜欢攀比,很多也都不太想努力,都想通过某种途径找到一个有钱的老公 让自己少奋斗很多年。这是很不好的社会现象,丢失 我们父母一代很多很宝贵的品质。虽然说中国的适婚男生比女生多了1000多万,但是为什么那么多中国女性成为了剩女,你们女人有考虑过这个问题吗?现在网上关于中国女人拜金的评论很多,不但中文网站有,英文网站也有,之前华尔街日报还专门对中国的婚姻观做过调查。谈恋爱不是谁对谁错的问题,不要去相互指责对方。其实婚姻就是平平淡淡的,我也不是一个有钱人,但是我一直在努力让生活更美好,而且我老婆平时也非常努力的支持我,支持这个家庭,让我有更多的动力去工作。

  40. 国男毛女屌丝
    国男毛女屌丝 November 24, 2014 at 9:24 pm | | Reply

    支持Ted弄个毛媳妇回国,给国女们看看什麽叫女人,你朋友Fred在上面给的Link看起来不错,什麽时候要去带爷们一块去,相互支持有个伴.我查到的要近20万,你有看到便宜些的吗?
    Support Ted marry a beautiful blonde. Show Caroline a proper women. Fred give good link for marriage agency in Eastern Europe. We should go together to support each other. I found agency cost 200,000 RMB. Do you know cheaper?

  41. A Chinese Bodybuilder
    A Chinese Bodybuilder November 24, 2014 at 9:50 pm | | Reply

    I can relate to what OP’s saying, especially when you live in big cities like Beijing or Shanghai, it’s sad, but true. There is also a modern slang spreading in Chinese colleges that says “True love ends after graduation.”

    But I also know of some of my female colleagues who’d like to share the burden with their mates. Only a handful of them, though. I agree, it’s the one-child policy that “ruins” this generation. But the Chinese media are also holding the responsibility.

    Personally, I find that girls from rural areas or small counties are more likely to be independent and have the traditional Chinese women trait that we admire. And girls who like sports and have hobbies(True hobbies, not those who label eating, sleeping as hobby) are also more sensible and rational.

    So, instead of attending blind dates and meet those stay-at-home-all-the-time-and-behave-like-a-irresponsible-kid girls, I suggest going to gyms, or hiking, camping, and surprises may come out of there, give it Chinese or Foreigner.

    我很认同楼主,尤其是当你住在北京和上海这样的大城市里面,虽然有点消极,但是是事实。有很多人在大学里拼命找对象,就是觉得在社会上功利观念太强了。

    不过我的一些女同事倒是有一些不在乎车房的,但是是少数。当代中国人都把女儿当个宝,尤其是独生子女,才会造成今天的情况。还有媒体的引导其实也占了很大一部分比重。

    每年回一次老家,其实发现小地方的女的相对来说没那么势利,稍微能好点。尤其那些喜欢运动的和有一些爱好的女的(不是那种把“吃”和“睡”的当成爱好的傻X)更独立,更成熟,也有自己的看法。

    所以与其去相亲遇到脑残碰一鼻子灰,还不如多跟一些朋友出去玩玩,扩大社交圈子,说不定能碰到合适的,管她什么黑白黄橙蓝绿紫。

  42. Laura
    Laura November 24, 2014 at 10:15 pm | | Reply

    Ted,

    I feel sorry you had this experience.
    Please keep in mind the following:
    1. A dinner, wherever it is, fast food restaurant-home-park,.. is important because you use that time to get to know a person. If something thinks that a fancy restaurant is required then that person is less focused on content and more focused on the cover.

    2. You do not owe explanations to anyone. Take these experiences, which are yours and only yours, and learn from them. Do not take comments seriously, after all, this is your experience. You are the only one who can have an opinion on your dates.

    3. Do not overthink. Those dates didn´t work for a reason, let´s move forward.

    4. When a person goes to a date and says that you are the third date in the same day….do as you think and feel. Is that person telling you that to pressure you?

    5. Less dates but better quality ones. Referrals from friends should work better.

    6. Please do not think that absolutely every Chinese girl is like that, same with western women. You will find an exception, from here or there or even closer than you think..or farther.

    7. When it comes to generalizing about women,we can be like tigers, we jump right the way. You can see this in the comments section. Some people felt attacked because of many reasons, but do not take it personally. Is not about you, is about the person writing that comment.
    – She might hate that you wrote that because she is also having bad experiences in China
    – She might be nice but tired of people who think she is like that
    – She might be like that and thinks there is nothing wrong with it
    – She might dislike foreigners because of past relationships
    – She might …etc etc…
    Ignore it if it hurts your feelings.

    8. Even thought you are hurt and tired, do not close doors to Chinese girls.

    9. Last but not least. Do not seek so much for it. Go for a tea – coffee, talk to people. Let it go naturally.

    1. Sorrel
      Sorrel November 24, 2014 at 11:38 pm | | Reply

      I agree.
      putting too much pressure on the first date to find a life partner is not the way to go. It builds up too much expectation on the other person to be perfect.
      During my first year in China I would relax in coffee shops at the weekend.
      one guy proposed to me on what turned out to be the second time he spoke to me and began pressuring me to meet his family.
      I had no idea that I had been anything other than casually friendly and the result was I avoided the coffee shop as I was freaked out.
      had he bothered to take his time and let me get to know him over time, I would probably have become interested. That way I could have had more of an in-depth idea of him as a person.
      As I said, life is not a race and anyone who is not willing to take the time to travel with you, even a short way to a better understanding of personality, has probably not that much going for them, whatever country they come from.
      I can understand that from a cultural perspective, you are probably under pressure for so many reasons, but finding the right life partner is probably the most important decision you will ever make in your life and you don’t want to make it based on maybe 3 hours or less conversation.

  43. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 10:23 pm | | Reply

    @A Chinese Bodybuilder

    Good tips. Living in a big city we usually face more variety of kinds of unexpected difficulties than in small cities, so we must learn how to adjust our attitudes to prevent nervousness and try to extend the network and circle of friends. Such the pungent social situation you pointed out.

  44. Ted
    Ted November 24, 2014 at 10:46 pm | | Reply

    @ Laura

    Very thankful, your comment is well to the point and I will keep them in my mind. It’s time to make a change.

    My work drives me crazy however I still need to manage to squeeze some time to meet new friends and do some sports. As a matter of fact I don’t really want to close doors to Chinese girls indeed, and I believe some good ones are here, it just takes time to meet them. No rush,marriage is not easy in anywhere in the world. I’d better take it easy, sometimes fate just happens to people without any notice.

  45. Bruce
    Bruce November 24, 2014 at 10:48 pm | | Reply

    Ted,

    I agree with A Chinese Bodybuilder! I’m not muscular like him though heheeheh hahahhaha lol 🙂 ! Take it natural and don’t think about marriage or having a gf. Let everything be natural. Blind dates won’t work out instantly dude! You have to date a woman for a few months in order to know her because first few months women won’t show their true identity!! I’ve mentioned this a few yrs here. Get with the program dude!!

  46. Bruce
    Bruce November 25, 2014 at 4:47 am | | Reply

    Caroline,

    Not all Chinese women are like this. We know that for a fact. Majority of those Chinese women have this kind of mentality thought.

  47. Wang Q
    Wang Q November 25, 2014 at 9:39 am | | Reply

    很同意楼上的最恨伪女权说的,这个帖子我之前也看过。说的很一针见血。很多中国女孩特别是80后,90后和我们这些70的尾巴的一代最大的差异就是他们变得越来越自私,对中国男人普遍喜欢运用双重准则。我一些身边男同事经常说男人没钱的时候,女人就侮辱人家,有钱的时候,就说男人花心,男人加班工作赚钱的时候,就认为男人对她们不关心。有些女人用二手三手的身体毫无羞耻的问男孩要一手的新房,还肆无忌惮的说‘爱她们就要爱她们的一切’。虽然我已是已婚人士,但是我还是觉得大多数中国男人真的活得很累很辛苦。之前评论上还有一个国女说有外国国籍,上海女人就能搞定?真的吗?我想外国国籍也一定要是发达国家的话的吧,如果是非洲,什么东欧的,你们这些中国女人估计也看不上眼吧。换句话说,你认为有发达国家国籍的男人都是傻子吗?他们不会不知道有些中国女人和他们结婚的真实原因。而且像和美国男人结婚,也不是马上就可以拿绿卡的。很多嫁到国外的中国女人什么样的生活状况,我们又不是不清楚。爱情本身和国籍,户籍,社会地位本没有特别大的联系,但是现在被你们这些中国女孩说的这么乌烟瘴气。

    如果一个女生连在哪里吃饭都会计较的话,这个女生骨子里面是很物质的,只是伪装的很好。我老婆曾经和我说,她和我谈恋爱最开心的时候就是在大排档吃串子的那种傻气。轻松,毫无压力。我很好奇现在很多中国女生要求男生比自己收入高几倍,是不是难道让男生把比你多赚的钱给你当零花钱?你们想的真的太多了,也请你们在有这种想法前,看自己配不配,在男生给你无限付出的时候,想想你能给男生付出什么,不要一味的想着索取。

    给Ted一点建议,就像有外国人评论的,不要给自己设定一个结婚年龄,婚姻不是一场比赛,也不是游戏,更不是交易。把心放宽一些,有些人的评论不需要太在意,适当的扩大自己的交际圈,去多认识一些朋友。这种blind dates不是特别的靠谱,你可以通过一些活动,旅游去认识一些新朋友。一定不要给自己太大的压力,切记婚姻不是一场比赛,没有胜负,婚姻不是那么容易的,需要夫妻双方一起努力,缺一不可。中国有句古话叫欲速而不达,很多闪婚的夫妻婚后觉得不合适,最后分手的。所以结婚前一定要足够去了解你的另一半,慢慢来。good luck!

  48. 随便看看
    随便看看 November 25, 2014 at 11:51 am | | Reply

    顶楼上!

  49. Dan
    Dan November 25, 2014 at 10:40 pm | | Reply

    Fascinating debate. I want to know how young people in China view marriage these days.

    I don’t think western girls don’t care about material side of things. But it tends not to be the focus in the courting stage. There are some certainly do. You probably don’t want to marry those princesses, very high maintenance. I am not under the impression most chinese girls are high maintenances. But increasing number of them are.

    Decades ago, Americans girls went to college to marry well. I see the same thing still happening in China. Maybe it is the pressure that a girl has to marry well that drives them to be so demanding. Once there is more opportunity provided to women in workplace, they might become more equal at home. On the other hand, culture plays a role. If you were taught to be domestic, you will define your gender role in similar terms – men supports family, and woman controls the house.

    No matter how pretty you are, you are downgrade after you marry in China. Maybe it is one reason those girls have to ask so much to make sure they stay valued. They live in a country one leg is stuck in feudal society.

    I don’t think finding a western girl is the answer to ted’s problems. Finding the right person is , however you define it. You will be dealing with a whole different set of problems in a cross-cultural relationship. Western girls want the same thing the chinese girls want – companionship, romance, security and personal success. But many western girls are brought up to have the ideas they can build their own lives without a man to support them. Once chinese girls can do the same, the dynamics will change. Both parties can focus on relationships at the beginning.

  50. Ted
    Ted November 26, 2014 at 9:27 pm | | Reply

    @ Dan,

    Your comment is quite practical, and there is undeniably a strong theoretical dimension to your thinking.

    We should see the two sides of the same problem. In big cities of China, girls are comparatively high maintenances. I bet the same situation happens in the States too, Ex. there are two girls, one from NYC, and other one from a small town in Nebraska. Unfortunately, I am living in a big city and I was always too. Living in a big city we usually face more variety of kinds of unexpected difficulties than in small cities, so we must learn how to adjust our attitudes to prevent nervousness and try to extend the network and circle of friends.

    I have been thinking with my blind dates experience very thoughtfully. Yeah, I got your point. Finding a western girl is may not the answer to my problem. This right girl could be anybody in anywhere, no geographical restrictions. I really admire somebody commented in the forum like’ dating is not a race trying to get married asap , finding the right life partner is probably the most important decision you will ever make in your life’. There is an old Chinese saying’ more haste, less speed’.

  51. Dan
    Dan November 26, 2014 at 10:59 pm | | Reply

    Not such a big difference between life in the country and the city in US. But you probably will get along with people with similar socio-economic background much easier. Everything in China can seem more complicated because the city can be so hostile. An young couple start up in US would expect to buy a house at some point in the future. There are simply more choices and more mobility. You can also send your children to schools without too many restrictions. To achieve the modest level of success in China comparing that of US requires so much more investment. I personally don’t blame the girls in China who ask for houses and cars. But I am not sure the decisions they make will pay off down the road. It almost seem tragic to live such a life.

  52. Bob
    Bob November 30, 2014 at 12:08 pm | | Reply

    I’m a long time reader of speakingofchina who enjoys reading blog entries from around the world and I’d like to share my opinion on this subject. Firstly, I’m an Australian born Chinese guy(25 yr old) and I have seen the type of women that the original poster has encountered and its all too common.

    There definitely is a huge difference between the attitudes of asian-born women vs those born in western countries. Western born chinese girls are so much better than the ones born in Asia because they are more independent and can financially take care of themselves just like any other caucasian woman. The women here are raised to be strong feminists mostly, whereas the ones in Asian are hypocrite, fake feminists and many have double standards when it comes to gender roles(expectations) and responsibilities.

    I know for a certain fact most chinese women in particular, feel incredibly lucky to get married to a white guy and are more motivated to treat a white guy better and this is why chinese women here have a reputation here as ‘good wives’. They clearly do it to get something in return and they do it to rub it in both asian men and white women. They also demonstrate how they make better wives than caucasian women. However most of them delude themselves thinking that their lives are better when in fact, East asian men in western countries all outearn their white male counterparts.

    My university classes are filled entirely with Chinese international students and they are all incredibly filthy rich. There are far more Chinese international students than the local white students at most of the universities here and I have a good idea of how they are like. Most of them are “Daddy’s girls’, i.e girls who respect their fathers more than their mothers because the dad makes loads of money. She respects him because she wants to continue living like a princess. I guarantee they will never make more money than their fathers. They are at a crossroads on whether to marry a man who makes just as much money than their father to continue their designer handbag shopping spree, or to settle down with someone reasonable.

    The lopsided AW/WM ratio always revolves around asian male bashing, and the white men here bash and trash talk white women here too.. It is certainly an interracial pairing which involves each person overrating themselves and trash talking their own type of men/women.

    I myself would never ever date an asian born woman because of her double standards and white worshipping complex. Are those asian born women materialistic? Yes mostly, and see how I say not all? I have a very unbiased and objective viewpoint.

    It’s not just white guys with yellow fever, indian/pakistani guys here also bash on their own indian women and they like chinese women too.

    To Ted, you look like a pretty good looking guy so I recommend you brush up on your English a bit and perhaps if you have what it takes, date western born asian women. They are a hell of a lot better than women who seek to upgrade themselves. Bare in mind the ones I’m talking about have high expectations too but they are not unreasonable and certainly don’t have double standards.

  53. Ted
    Ted November 30, 2014 at 12:45 pm | | Reply

    @ Bob,I couldn’t agree with you more.

  54. Wang Q
    Wang Q November 30, 2014 at 1:01 pm | | Reply

    楼上的那个Australian born Chinese说的太对了。这也是我之前说的双重准则。确实存在亚裔女性为了身份和发达国家的白人男子结婚。婚后开始表现非常的好,但是当她们得到她们想得到的时候,就会撕开面具,露出真面目。真的是hypocrite, fake feminists and many have double standards when it comes to gender roles(expectations) and responsibilities。 顶一个!!!!

  55. Bob
    Bob November 30, 2014 at 3:20 pm | | Reply

    I have found a video which perfectly describes the state of chinese women. Unfortunately its on youtube and those in China would not be able to access it.

    If someone could rehost it for the chinese viewers.

  56. Bob
    Bob November 30, 2014 at 3:22 pm | | Reply

    opps typo can’t edit comment^ Those in China will not be able access it.

  57. Bruce
    Bruce December 1, 2014 at 10:05 am | | Reply

    I watched this a while ago. I would never marry these types of Chinese women in China. Everything is based on money. Seriously, Chinese is all about money in China. The society is very different there. This video is pretty scary for some men and I do mean it.

  58. Wang Q
    Wang Q December 1, 2014 at 1:18 pm | | Reply

    刚才我把那个澳洲华人推荐的视频看了一下,我很生气
    1. 中国女人感觉认为生下来的孩子是男人一个人的,和她们女人没有关系,男人就应该给他们孩子最好的,请问你作为孩子的妈,女人该做什么??孩子生下来,不应该只有个爸吧。难道你们女人觉得你们对孩子只是局外人???

    2. 男人赚钱都该给女人花吗?那你女人赚钱也从来不想着给男人买点东西??那么自私?你这样,你妈知道吗?男人赚钱给你一个人花,给你父母花,你想的真美,他们男人不用孝敬自己的父母?? 这样的女人以后怎么相夫教子???道德沦丧啊,不如你嫁给钱好了。你生病住院,让钱来照顾你吧。

    3. 视频中有一个女的说抚养一个孩子要500万,到他出国为止,我看这个女的,你干脆以后和你孩子一起陪葬算了。孩子到一定年纪就应该自己独立生活了。没有钱,就不要出国,在国内不也挺好。500万,你以为500万那么好赚,一年20万的高收入,都要不吃不喝25年一个人。何况很多人还赚不到20万一年。真是痴人说梦话。

    这一代中国年轻女人,你们拿什么来自救啊!!! 伤心啊!!!

  59. Fred
    Fred December 2, 2014 at 7:07 am | | Reply

    @ Ted.

    I think your best bet is to take it easy and take a nonchalant attitude by not looking too intensively. Just casually meet a girl, talk to her and if she seems decent, then ask her out for a simple date over coffee or lunch. Don’t think about spending too much money on her. If she demands an expensive place, then you will know that she is not the one for you. Please remember that love is natural and if she tries to impede this natural process by placing artificial requirements such as wealth, expensive cars, an apartment, etc. before love, then you will know that she is not likely to be the one for you anyway.

    I know that due to the great gender imbalance of males over females in China that the females can be more picky. But you must not supplicate by catering to her every whim and expensive demands. You must treat her with decency and respect and in the end you will prevail.

    Fred

  60. Bruce
    Bruce December 3, 2014 at 2:19 am | | Reply

    Yes, take it easy. It’s tough to find love man. Ted, always put love first on your list and the rest is not important. You want a woman who is loyal , funny and has principles. You want someone who will go thru hardship with you.

    1. Fred
      Fred December 3, 2014 at 2:24 am | | Reply

      @ Bruce.

      Ditto.

      Fred

  61. Bruce
    Bruce December 3, 2014 at 4:20 am | | Reply

    Fred,

    You love it huh??? lol 🙂

  62. Sveta
    Sveta December 8, 2014 at 2:26 pm | | Reply

    When I was dating a Korean guy, I recall he made similar complaints about modern Korean women. I’m actually pretty shocked by what I read about Chinese women on here. I did hear about the money house and car from this blog, but no housework or laziness, that’s shocking! ( I admit that I tend to be lazy at times, but even I know that there has to be cooking and housework involved.)

  63. Manny
    Manny March 21, 2015 at 1:39 am | | Reply

    @ “Ted”.

    Wow! You dated 15 Chinese girl!. Wholly Lord Jesus!. In my neck of the woods, we would call you “the man” or “the man in the driver’s seat.” I dreamed of dating many slim and sexy Chinese girls but was not able to make it come true. I cannot even get a third of the amount of dates that you got in my entire life time. Were those China dolls pretty? Were they slim and sexy? Did you get some? Give us boys here the details.

  64. 另一国女
    另一国女 June 28, 2015 at 3:59 pm | | Reply

    时间过的真快,这是去年写的,那楼主现在有白人女友了吗?

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